Archief - bluetooth dongle in linux

Het archief is een bevroren moment uit een vorige versie van dit forum, met andere regels en andere bazen. Deze posts weerspiegelen op geen enkele manier onze huidige ideeën, waarden of wereldbeelden en zijn op sommige plaatsen gecensureerd wegens ontoelaatbaar. Veel zijn in een andere tijdsgeest gemaakt, al dan niet ironisch - zoals in het ironische subforum Off-Topic - en zouden op dit moment niet meer gepost (mogen) worden. Toch bieden we dit archief nog graag aan als informatiedatabank en naslagwerk. Lees er hier meer over of start een gesprek met anderen.

M_N_M

Legacy Member
Hallo,

ik heb een Synology DS106-E (NAS) die ik via Putty kan benaderen zodat ik in de linux omgeving kom.

Op de NAS zitten 3 USB poorten, hiermee zou ik graag een bluetooth USB stick werkend krijgen zodat ik hcitool kan gebruiken.

Ik heb het op internet al gevonden maar ik raak er niet echt wijs uit :(
(ipkg heb ik er reeds op gekregen maar "ipkg install bluez" geeft telkens de melding dat hij het packet bluez niet kan vinden :()

Is er iemand die mij op weg kan zetten?

Bedankt!

M_N_M

Legacy Member
hallo,

stom van mij, dat pakket bestond idd niet :p
Nu heb ik inderdaad die "hcitool" tot mijn beschikking maar nu krijg ik volgende fout:
Code:
nas> hcitool scan
Device is not available: Address family not supported by protocol

De bluetooth USB dongle zit er in MAAR buiten deze erin pluggen heb ik nog niets gedaan (ik weet niet of die compatible is, allemaal weinig over te vinden via internet :(); moet ik buiten bluez installeren nog iets anders doen om die werkend te krijgen?

Ter info: deze handleiding ben ik aan het volgen: How to read from SMA Bluetooth

Alles is mij duidelijk (MySQL, cronjobs, ... heb ik reeds gedaan) buiten die bluetooth werkend krijgen, dat heb ik nog nooit gedaan in linux.

M_N_M

Legacy Member
lsusb kent hij niet; dmesg geeft een ganse lijst terug maar iets van BT vind ik niet terug :S

Zou het kunnen dat die stick gewoon niet ondersteund is en dat ik daarom die /etc/bluetooth niet heb?

Ter info: via "ipkg" heb ik enkel "bluez-utils" en "bluez-apps" kunnen installeren, "bluez" stond er niet in.. Bij andere synology's zie ik ook "kernel-module-bluetooth" staan maar bij de mijne bestaat dat ook niet :(

Zir0h

Legacy Member
Merk/type/chipset van de USB stick?
Is er iets terug te vinden in dmesg ivm usb apparaten?
Wat heb je op het internet al gevonden?

M_N_M

Legacy Member
wat ik vreemd vind, is dat ik op internet overal "kernel-module-bluetooth" moet installeren en dat pakket staat gewoon niet in mijn "ipkg" lijst :(

Hier is mn "dmesg > /volume1/Public/export":
[ 0.000000] Linux version 2.6.32.12 (root@image13) (gcc version 4.2.1) #1354 Sat Oct 23 00:49:24 CST 2010
[ 0.000000] CPU: Feroceon 88FR131 [56251311] revision 1 (ARMv5TE), cr=00053977
[ 0.000000] CPU: VIVT data cache, VIVT instruction cache
[ 0.000000] Machine: Synology 6282 board
[ 0.000000] Using UBoot passing parameters structure
[ 0.000000] Sys Clk = 200000000, Tclk = 166666667
[ 0.000000] Synology Board ID: 23
[ 0.000000] Memory policy: ECC disabled, Data cache writeback
[ 0.000000] On node 0 totalpages: 65536
[ 0.000000] free_area_init_node: node 0, pgdat c03c86d8, node_mem_map c0421000
[ 0.000000] Normal zone: 512 pages used for memmap
[ 0.000000] Normal zone: 0 pages reserved
[ 0.000000] Normal zone: 65024 pages, LIFO batch:15
[ 0.000000] Built 1 zonelists in Zone order, mobility grouping on. Total pages: 65024
[ 0.000000] Kernel command line: console=ttyS0,115200 ip=off initrd=0x00800040,4M root=/dev/md0 rw syno_hw_version=DS211v10 ihd_num=2 netif_num=1
[ 0.000000] Synology Hareware Version: DS211v10-j
[ 0.000000] Internal HD num: 2
[ 0.000000] Internal netif num: 1
[ 0.000000] PID hash table entries: 1024 (order: 0, 4096 bytes)
[ 0.000000] Dentry cache hash table entries: 32768 (order: 5, 131072 bytes)
[ 0.000000] Inode-cache hash table entries: 16384 (order: 4, 65536 bytes)
[ 0.000000] Memory: 256MB = 256MB total
[ 0.000000] Memory: 251264KB available (3400K code, 457K data, 116K init, 0K highmem)
[ 0.000000] Hierarchical RCU implementation.
[ 0.000000] NR_IRQS:128
[ 0.000000] Console: colour dummy device 80x30
[ 0.000000] Calibrating delay loop... 1589.24 BogoMIPS (lpj=7946240)
[ 0.240000] Mount-cache hash table entries: 512
[ 0.240000] CPU: Testing write buffer coherency: ok
[ 0.240000] xor: measuring software checksum speed
[ 0.290000] arm4regs : 1446.400 MB/sec
[ 0.340000] 8regs : 1097.600 MB/sec
[ 0.390000] 32regs : 1230.800 MB/sec
[ 0.390000] xor: using function: arm4regs (1446.400 MB/sec)
[ 0.390000] NET: Registered protocol family 16
[ 0.390000] Feroceon L2: Enabling L2
[ 0.390000] Feroceon L2: Cache support initialised, in WT override mode.
[ 0.410000]
[ 0.410000] CPU Interface
[ 0.410000] -------------
[ 0.410000] SDRAM_CS0 ....base 00000000, size 256MB
[ 0.410000] SDRAM_CS1 ....disable
[ 0.410000] SDRAM_CS2 ....disable
[ 0.410000] SDRAM_CS3 ....disable
[ 0.410000] PEX0_MEM ....base e0000000, size 128MB
[ 0.410000] PEX0_IO ....base f2000000, size 1MB
[ 0.410000] PEX1_MEM ....base e8000000, size 128MB
[ 0.410000] PEX1_IO ....base f2100000, size 1MB
[ 0.410000] INTER_REGS ....base f1000000, size 1MB
[ 0.410000] NFLASH_CS ....base fa000000, size 2MB
[ 0.410000] SPI_CS ....base f4000000, size 16MB
[ 0.410000] BOOT_ROM_CS ....no such
[ 0.410000] DEV_BOOTCS ....no such
[ 0.410000] CRYPT_ENG ....base f0000000, size 2MB
[ 0.410000] Detected Tclk 200000000 and SysClk 533333333
[ 0.410000] Synology 6282 1, 2 bay GPIO Init
[ 0.910000] PEX0 interface detected no Link.
[ 1.410000] PEX1 interface detected no Link.
[ 1.410000] PCI: bus0: Fast back to back transfers enabled
[ 1.410000] PCI: bus1: Fast back to back transfers enabled
[ 1.420000] bio: create slab <bio-0> at 0
[ 1.420000] vgaarb: loaded
[ 1.420000] SCSI subsystem initialized
[ 1.420000] libata version 3.00 loaded.
[ 1.590000] raid6: int32x1 121 MB/s
[ 1.760000] raid6: int32x2 142 MB/s
[ 1.930000] raid6: int32x4 163 MB/s
[ 2.100000] raid6: int32x8 143 MB/s
[ 2.100000] raid6: using algorithm int32x4 (163 MB/s)
[ 2.100000] Switching to clocksource kw_clocksource
[ 2.100000] NET: Registered protocol family 2
[ 2.100000] IP route cache hash table entries: 2048 (order: 1, 8192 bytes)
[ 2.100000] TCP established hash table entries: 8192 (order: 4, 65536 bytes)
[ 2.100000] TCP bind hash table entries: 8192 (order: 3, 32768 bytes)
[ 2.100000] TCP: Hash tables configured (established 8192 bind 8192)
[ 2.100000] TCP reno registered
[ 2.100000] NET: Registered protocol family 1
[ 2.100000] RPC: Registered udp transport module.
[ 2.100000] RPC: Registered tcp transport module.
[ 2.100000] RPC: Registered tcp NFSv4.1 backchannel transport module.
[ 2.100000] Trying to unpack rootfs image as initramfs...
[ 2.100000] rootfs image is not initramfs (no cpio magic); looks like an initrd
[ 2.120000] Freeing initrd memory: 4096K
[ 2.120000] XOR registered 4 channels
[ 2.120000] XOR 2nd invalidate WA enabled
[ 2.120000] VFS: Disk quotas dquot_6.5.2
[ 2.120000] Dquot-cache hash table entries: 1024 (order 0, 4096 bytes)
[ 2.120000] msgmni has been set to 499
[ 2.120000] Block layer SCSI generic (bsg) driver version 0.4 loaded (major 254)
[ 2.120000] io scheduler noop registered
[ 2.120000] io scheduler anticipatory registered (default)
[ 2.130000] Serial: 8250/16550 driver, 4 ports, IRQ sharing disabled
[ 2.130000] serial8250.0: ttyS0 at MMIO 0xf1012000 (irq = 33) is a 16550A
[ 2.140000] console [ttyS0] enabled
[ 2.140000] serial8250.1: ttyS1 at MMIO 0xf1012100 (irq = 34) is a 16550A
[ 2.150000] brd: module loaded
[ 2.160000] sata_mv sata_mv.0: version 1.28
[ 2.160000] sata_mv sata_mv.0: slots 32 ports 2
[ 2.170000] scsi0 : sata_mv
[ 2.170000] scsi1 : sata_mv
[ 2.170000] ata1: SATA max UDMA/133 irq 21
[ 2.180000] ata2: SATA max UDMA/133 irq 21
[ 2.180000] Delay 10 seconds to wait for disk 1 ready.
[ 12.680000] ata1: SATA link up 3.0 Gbps (SStatus 123 SControl F300)
[ 12.720000] ata1.00: ATA-8: WDC WD20EARS-00J2GB0, 80.00A80, max UDMA/133
[ 12.720000] ata1.00: 3907029168 sectors, multi 0: LBA48 NCQ (depth 31/32)
[ 12.770000] ata1.00: configured for UDMA/133
[ 12.770000] scsi 0:0:0:0: Direct-Access WDC WD20EARS-00J2GB0 80.0 PQ: 0 ANSI: 5
[ 12.780000] sd 0:0:0:0: [sda] 3907029168 512-byte logical blocks: (2.00 TB/1.81 TiB)
[ 12.790000] sd 0:0:0:0: [sda] Write Protect is off
[ 12.790000] sd 0:0:0:0: [sda] Mode Sense: 00 3a 00 00
[ 12.790000] sd 0:0:0:0: [sda] Write cache: enabled, read cache: enabled, doesn't support DPO or FUA
[ 12.800000] sda: sda1 sda2 sda3
[ 12.840000] sd 0:0:0:0: [sda] Attached SCSI disk
[ 19.390000] ata2: link is slow to respond, please be patient (ready=0)
[ 23.890000] ata2: SRST failed (errno=-16)
[ 28.300000] ata2: SATA link up 3.0 Gbps (SStatus 123 SControl F300)
[ 28.360000] ata2.00: ATA-8: WDC WD20EARS-00J2GB0, 80.00A80, max UDMA/133
[ 28.360000] ata2.00: 3907029168 sectors, multi 0: LBA48 NCQ (depth 31/32)
[ 28.430000] ata2.00: configured for UDMA/133
[ 28.430000] scsi 1:0:0:0: Direct-Access WDC WD20EARS-00J2GB0 80.0 PQ: 0 ANSI: 5
[ 28.440000] sd 1:0:0:0: [sdb] 3907029168 512-byte logical blocks: (2.00 TB/1.81 TiB)
[ 28.450000] sd 1:0:0:0: [sdb] Write Protect is off
[ 28.450000] sd 1:0:0:0: [sdb] Mode Sense: 00 3a 00 00
[ 28.450000] sd 1:0:0:0: [sdb] Write cache: enabled, read cache: enabled, doesn't support DPO or FUA
[ 28.460000] sdb: sdb1 sdb2 sdb3
[ 28.470000] sd 1:0:0:0: [sdb] Attached SCSI disk
[ 28.470000] physmap platform flash device: 00400000 at f8000000
[ 28.480000] SPI Serial flash detected @ 0xf8000000, 4096KB (64sec x 64KB)
[ 28.490000] Searching for RedBoot partition table in SYNOMTD-0 at offset 0x3f0000
[ 28.500000] 6 RedBoot partitions found on MTD device SYNOMTD-0
[ 28.510000] SYNOMTD flash bank 0: Using RedBoot partition definition
[ 28.510000] Creating 6 MTD partitions on "SYNOMTD-0":
[ 28.520000] 0x000000000000-0x000000080000 : "RedBoot"
[ 28.520000] 0x000000080000-0x000000280000 : "zImage"
[ 28.530000] 0x000000280000-0x0000003c0000 : "rd.gz"
[ 28.530000] 0x0000003c0000-0x0000003d0000 : "vendor"
[ 28.540000] vender Mac1 checksum error ucSum:0x00 Buf:0x00 Sum:0.
[ 28.550000] Serial Number: ACH1N00035
[ 28.550000] 0x0000003d0000-0x0000003f0000 : "RedBoot Config"
[ 28.560000] 0x0000003f0000-0x000000400000 : "FIS directory"
[ 28.560000] Loading Marvell Ethernet Driver:
[ 28.570000] o Cached descriptors in DRAM
[ 28.570000] o DRAM SW cache-coherency
[ 28.570000] o 2 Giga ports supported
[ 28.580000] o Single RX Queue support - ETH_DEF_RXQ=0
[ 28.580000] o Single TX Queue support - ETH_DEF_TXQ=0
[ 28.590000] o TCP segmentation offload (TSO) supported
[ 28.590000] o Receive checksum offload supported
[ 28.600000] o Transmit checksum offload supported
[ 28.600000] o Rx descripors: q0=128
[ 28.610000] o Tx descripors: q0=532
[ 28.610000] o Loading network interface(s):
[ 28.620000] o register under mv88fx_eth platform
[ 28.620000] o eth0, ifindex = 2, GbE port = 0
[ 28.630000] o eth0, phy chipid = 1410e40, Support WOL = 0
[ 28.630000]
[ 28.630000] md: linear personality registered for level -1
[ 28.640000] md: raid0 personality registered for level 0
[ 28.640000] md: raid1 personality registered for level 1
[ 28.650000] md: raid10 personality registered for level 10
[ 28.660000] md: raid6 personality registered for level 6
[ 28.660000] md: raid5 personality registered for level 5
[ 28.670000] md: raid4 personality registered for level 4
[ 28.670000] device-mapper: ioctl: 4.15.0-ioctl (2009-04-01) initialised: [email protected]
[ 28.680000] cpuidle: using governor ladder
[ 28.680000] TCP cubic registered
[ 28.690000] NET: Registered protocol family 17
[ 28.690000] md: Waiting for all devices to be available before autodetect
[ 28.700000] md: If you don't use raid, use raid=noautodetect
[ 28.710000] md: Autodetecting RAID arrays.
[ 28.780000] md: invalid raid superblock magic on sda3
[ 28.790000] md: sda3 does not have a valid v0.90 superblock, not importing!
[ 28.850000] md: invalid raid superblock magic on sdb3
[ 28.850000] md: sdb3 does not have a valid v0.90 superblock, not importing!
[ 28.860000] md: Scanned 6 and added 4 devices.
[ 28.860000] md: autorun ...
[ 28.870000] md: considering sda1 ...
[ 28.870000] md: adding sda1 ...
[ 28.870000] md: sda2 has different UUID to sda1
[ 28.880000] md: adding sdb1 ...
[ 28.880000] md: sdb2 has different UUID to sda1
[ 28.890000] md: created md0
[ 28.890000] md: bind<sdb1>
[ 28.890000] md: bind<sda1>
[ 28.900000] md: running: <sda1><sdb1>
[ 28.900000] md: md0: set sda1 to auto_remap [0]
[ 28.900000] md: md0: set sdb1 to auto_remap [0]
[ 28.910000] raid1: raid set md0 active with 2 out of 2 mirrors
[ 28.910000] md0: detected capacity change from 0 to 2549940224
[ 28.920000] md: considering sda2 ...
[ 28.920000] md: adding sda2 ...
[ 28.930000] md: adding sdb2 ...
[ 28.930000] md: created md1
[ 28.930000] md: bind<sdb2>
[ 28.940000] md: bind<sda2>
[ 28.940000] md: running: <sda2><sdb2>
[ 28.940000] md: md1: set sda2 to auto_remap [0]
[ 28.950000] md: md1: set sdb2 to auto_remap [0]
[ 28.950000] raid1: raid set md1 active with 2 out of 2 mirrors
[ 28.960000] md1: detected capacity change from 0 to 2147418112
[ 28.960000] md: ... autorun DONE.
[ 28.970000] RAMDISK: gzip image found at block 0
[ 29.110000] VFS: Mounted root (ext2 filesystem) on device 1:0.
[ 29.130000] ds211_synobios: module license 'Synology Inc.' taints kernel.
[ 29.140000] Disabling lock debugging due to kernel taint
[ 29.160000] correction with 0x03
[ 29.260000] synobios: load, major number 201
[ 29.260000] Brand: Synology
[ 29.270000] Model: DS-211
[ 29.290000] synobios: unload
[ 29.330000] md0: unknown partition table
[ 29.960000] EXT4-fs (md0): barriers disabled
[ 29.980000] EXT4-fs (md0): mounted filesystem with ordered data mode
[ 30.320000] synoacl module [synoacl_ext4] is not loaded
[ 30.330000] synoacl module [synoacl_vfs] is not loaded
[ 30.360000] EXT3-fs: md0: couldn't mount because of unsupported optional features (240).
[ 30.360000] EXT2-fs: md0: couldn't mount because of unsupported optional features (240).
[ 30.370000] EXT4-fs (md0): barriers disabled
[ 30.380000] EXT4-fs (md0): mounted filesystem with ordered data mode
[ 30.380000] VFS: Mounted root (ext4 filesystem) on device 9:0.
[ 30.390000] Trying to move old root to /initrd ... okay
[ 30.400000] Freeing init memory: 116K
[ 30.620000] md1: unknown partition table
[ 30.620000] Adding 2097080k swap on /dev/md1. Priority:-1 extents:1 across:2097080k
[ 30.710000] sd 0:0:0:0: Attached scsi generic sg0 type 0
[ 30.740000] sd 1:0:0:0: Attached scsi generic sg1 type 0
[ 30.860000] usbcore: registered new interface driver usbfs
[ 30.870000] usbcore: registered new interface driver hub
[ 30.870000] usbcore: registered new device driver usb
[ 31.000000] cpufreq: Init kirkwood cpufreq driver
[ 31.000000] cpufreq: High frequency: 1600000KHz - Low frequency: 533333KHz
[ 31.000000] cpufreq: Setting CPU Frequency to 1600000 KHz
[ 31.000000] cpufreq: Setting PowerSaveState to off
[ 31.150000] alg: No test for md5 (md5-generic)
[ 31.170000] alg: No test for aes (aes-generic)
[ 31.210000] alg: No test for stdrng (ansi_cprng)
[ 31.220000] alg: No test for stdrng (krng)
[ 31.250000] alg: No test for crc32c (crc32c-generic)
[ 31.260000] alg: No test for des (des-generic)
[ 31.260000] alg: No test for des3_ede (des3_ede-generic)
[ 31.350000] cesadev_init(bf123000)
[ 31.360000] mvCesaInit: sessions=10240, queue=64, pSram=f0000000
[ 31.380000] alg: No test for sha1 (sha1-generic)
[ 31.400000] alg: No test for sha224 (sha224-generic)
[ 31.410000] alg: No test for sha256 (sha256-generic)
[ 31.430000] alg: No test for sha384 (sha384-generic)
[ 31.440000] alg: No test for sha512 (sha512-generic)
[ 31.490000] encryptfs using the OCF package.
[ 31.680000] fuse init (API version 7.13)
[ 31.940000] NET: Registered protocol family 10
[ 31.950000] lo: Disabled Privacy Extensions
[ 31.970000] sky2 driver version 1.25
[ 32.020000] correction with 0x03
[ 32.110000] synobios: load, major number 201
[ 32.110000] Brand: Synology
[ 32.120000] Model: DS-211
[ 32.240000] eth0: mac address changed
[ 34.240000] eth0: link down
[ 34.250000] eth0: started
[ 34.250000] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_UP): eth0: link is not ready
[ 34.910000] md: md2 stopped.
[ 35.000000] md: bind<sdb3>
[ 35.000000] md: bind<sda3>
[ 35.000000] md: md2: set sda3 to auto_remap [0]
[ 35.010000] md: md2: set sdb3 to auto_remap [0]
[ 35.020000] raid1: raid set md2 active with 2 out of 2 mirrors
[ 35.020000] md2: detected capacity change from 0 to 1995564318720
[ 35.070000] md2: unknown partition table
[ 36.010000] eth0: link up, full duplex, speed 1 Gbps
[ 36.010000] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_CHANGE): eth0: link becomes ready
[ 36.890000] EXT4-fs (md2): barriers disabled
[ 37.000000] EXT4-fs (md2): mounted filesystem with writeback data mode
[ 43.100000] ata1.00: configured for UDMA/133
[ 43.100000] ata1: EH complete
[ 43.100000] ata2.00: configured for UDMA/133
[ 43.110000] ata2: EH complete
[ 46.320000] eth0: no IPv6 routers present
[ 51.340000] ehci_hcd: USB 2.0 'Enhanced' Host Controller (EHCI) Driver
[ 51.350000] orion-ehci orion-ehci.0: Marvell Orion EHCI
[ 51.350000] orion-ehci orion-ehci.0: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 1
[ 51.400000] orion-ehci orion-ehci.0: irq 19, io mem 0xf1050000
[ 51.420000] orion-ehci orion-ehci.0: USB 2.0 started, EHCI 1.00
[ 51.420000] usb usb1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 51.450000] hub 1-0:1.0: USB hub found
[ 51.450000] hub 1-0:1.0: 1 port detected
[ 51.520000] ohci_hcd: USB 1.1 'Open' Host Controller (OHCI) Driver
[ 51.610000] Initializing USB Mass Storage driver...
[ 51.620000] usbcore: registered new interface driver usb-storage
[ 51.620000] USB Mass Storage support registered.
[ 51.760000] usbcore: registered new interface driver usblp
[ 51.780000] usb 1-1: new high speed USB device using orion-ehci and address 2
[ 51.930000] usbcore: registered new interface driver hiddev
[ 51.930000] usbcore: registered new interface driver usbhid
[ 51.940000] usbhid: v2.6:USB HID core driver
[ 51.940000] usb 1-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 51.990000] hub 1-1:1.0: USB hub found
[ 51.990000] hub 1-1:1.0: 4 ports detected
[ 52.040000] Got empty serial number. Generate serial number from product.
[ 60.400000] NET: Registered protocol family 5
[ 60.940000] usbcore: registered new interface driver snd-usb-audio
[ 67.310000] findhostd uses obsolete (PF_INET,SOCK_PACKET)
[216254.550000] usb 1-1.1: new full speed USB device using orion-ehci and address 3
[216254.690000] usb 1-1.1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice

Merk + Type USB Dongle: laat ik vanavond weten, op mn werk nu.

M_N_M

Legacy Member
Got it (gevonden in mn mails :p): Belkin F8T009

Wat ik dus vreemd vind:
- ik heb geen "/etc/defaults/bluetooth"
- ik heb het pakket "kernel-module-bluetooth" niet in de lijst van "ipkg" staan (bluez ook niet, enkel "bluez-utils" en "bluez-apps" en die heb ik erop gezet)

Ik heb er geen probleem mee om een andere bluetooth dongle te kopen (deze is al een oudere) maar ik wil dan wel zeker weten dat het gaat werken en volgens mij staat nu enkel de linux config nog niet goed doordat ik die kernel-module niet kan installeren :(

Thx alvast voor de hulp!

M_N_M

Legacy Member
op deze link worden die modules (handmatig) gedownload voor een ARM cpu:
Bluetooth on QNAP

Waarom zou ik die kunnen vinden voor mijn CPU? (Freescale mpc8241 PPC Processor)
Het archief is een bevroren moment uit een vorige versie van dit forum, met andere regels en andere bazen. Deze posts weerspiegelen op geen enkele manier onze huidige ideeën, waarden of wereldbeelden en zijn op sommige plaatsen gecensureerd wegens ontoelaatbaar. Veel zijn in een andere tijdsgeest gemaakt, al dan niet ironisch - zoals in het ironische subforum Off-Topic - en zouden op dit moment niet meer gepost (mogen) worden. Toch bieden we dit archief nog graag aan als informatiedatabank en naslagwerk. Lees er hier meer over of start een gesprek met anderen.
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